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  • RelationSHIFT 2: It’s More than a Sex Narrative

    RelationSHIFT 2: It’s More than a Sex Narrative
    2026/06/02
    Dr. Jackie Roese Kay Daigle In this second episode of this series, Dr. Jackie Roese explains the problem with the church's sex narrative. Don't miss this important conversation as she talks with Dr. Kay Daigle about how making men's and women's relationships in the church all about sex is a mistake and why it matters. Many of us have been taught the church's sex narrative and may need to consider its effects. Other Resources Dr. Sandra Glahn on Biblical Manhood and Womanhood Dr. Sandra Glahn on Women in Public Ministry: 1. Revisiting the Issue as Individuals; 2. Revisiting the Issue as Churches. and 3. Misread Women of the Bible. This episode can be accessed on video along with the first episode, It's Time for a RelationSHIFT: It's more than being biblical. If you missed it, you can find the 1st BOW Podcast episode on seeking a RelationSHIFT between men and women in the church: It's More than Being Biblical. Timestamps: 00:21 Introductions 01:13 An example 02:52 Sensitivity toward those who have been abused 03:23 The danger narrative/danger-romance narrative in the Church. 07:36 Is this narrative biblical? 08:48 The biblical narrative TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle of Beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. I'd like to welcome you to the second in our series on It's Time for a RelationSHIFT dealing with men and women working together in the church. My guest is Dr. Jackie Roese. Jackie is the Founder and President of The Marcella Project. And you can read more about her and her ministry online on our website at BeyondOrdinaryWomen.org. And I hope you will take advantage of that so that you can even contact Jackie if you need to. Jackie, in our first video, we talked about the fact that the situation between men and women and the way that we work together in the church is more than just the biblical and theological beliefs that we have. In this video, we're going to talk about the fact that there's more involved than just a sex narrative. And I wanted to tell you that not too long ago, a friend highly praised a sermon that she had just heard, so I went online to hear the sermon. It was about men and women together. And I think in light of all of the various things, the sermon focused on how to avoid any kind of sexual contact with anyone of the other sex. But I was pretty horrified because really if you followed what it said, pretty much you wouldn't talk to many men. And he seemed to suggest he told a story about a pastor who was having a book signing and whose son said, why are you so rude to the women? He said, “Oh, they'll whisper their hotel room number in your ear. They'll give you their key.” It seemed to be perfectly fine, according to the sermon, to just be rude to women to avoid them tempting you sexually. So with that background of my horror, really, at thinking about how does somebody even do this in this age with work and things like that, I don't even think it's a practical solution. But even if it were, there's something wrong with treating people poorly just because you think they're a threat. So I want to hear what you had to say. Jackie >> Yeah. So, wow, there's a lot there. First, I would say not only is it wrong because it's not biblical. Kay >> Oh, yeah. Jackie >> So, and this person that you were listening to, they're still teaching this danger romance narrative as the only narrative we see in Scripture. And it's actually not the largest narrative we see. It's not the emphasis of the New Testament. And so I want to talk a little about that. Before I do, let me just say with the #MeToo #ChurchToo movement, there has been a lot of sexual exploitation. And I am very aware and want to be very sensitive to the fact that when there is sexual failure in the church or in the home, it's devastating. And I want to be sensitive to that because people have experienced that. It has blown up their church when their pastor has been inappropriate with a woman or...
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    12 分
  • RelationSHIFT 1: It’s More than Being Biblical

    RelationSHIFT 1: It’s More than Being Biblical
    2026/05/19
    Dr. Jackie Roese Dr. Kay Daigle Dr. Jackie Roese joined Kay Daigle some time ago on video (before we started creating podcasts) to discuss Jackie's call for a shift in working relationships between men and women in the church. If you are in any type of leadership--whether paid or unpaid--in a church, you should hear this conversation. Jackie points out some of the walls that women often bump against when they attempt to get things done through men on church staffs. Thus we need a shift in working relationships between men and women in the church. You can now access the videos of the other two conversations. The podcast episodes will drop on 6/3/26 and 6/17/26: It's More Than a Sex Narrative God's Dream Team Other Related BOW Podcast Episodes Healthy Churches for Women Biblical Manhood & Womanhood Timestamps: 00:20 Introductions 01:15 Beyond the biblical passages, why do we need to relate better as men & women in the church? 04:04 This conversation is for women regardless of their position about what women can or cannot do in the church. 05:11 What walls that have nothing to do with the Bible sometimes get in the way of working well with men? TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle of Beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. I'd like to welcome you to our video series, It's Time for a RelationSHIFT. And our guest is Dr. Jackie Roese. I have known Jackie since we were in D.T.S. together. And I have been so looking forward to this conversation because this first video is going to be a conversation about It's More Than Being Biblical. And when we talk about a shift in relationships, we're talking about men and women in the church. With all that's been going on in the last couple of years with #metoo and #churchtoo, and all of those things, there's been a lot of conversation about men and women. And much of what I've heard, Jackie, is actually saying that it all has to do with our biblical view of women in the church. And yet you're saying it's more than the theology of women in the church, that there's more at stake here. So I'm very excited to hear what you have to say. Jackie >> Great. Well, thank you for having me here. I'm glad to be here. Yes. First, let me say it does have to do with the Bible. I've been with women who said, “Oh, we don't need to work with 1 Timothy 2. We don't need to figure out, you know, 1 Corinthians 11 or 14. We can just those are ancient texts. They don't apply to us in the modern world.” And so they just don't even want to deal with them. And I'm like, no, no time out. We have got to go and dig and do hard work in the text. We've got to understand those biblical passages. So it is about the Bible, but it is actually about more than the Bible. So what do I mean by that? We have men and women scholars who have in the conservative evangelical world who have studied these particular texts that seem to prohibit women from being fully inclusive in all different leadership roles in the church. And those men and women have landed on very different interpretations—same conservative evangelical faith, tradition, you know, orthodox theologians, and they disagree. Kay >> They're not, it's not a liberal/conservative thing. Jackie >> No, it is not someone way over here or someone way over here. I'm talking about people in your own circle. Theologians and scholars in your own circle disagree on the interpretation of those passages that seem to restrict women. So we have that, and we need to deal with that. That's first and foremost. But I've been a pastor for about 20 years and being a female pastor who happens to be gifted in preaching, I had to learn that it has to do with more than just what your stances on those particular passages. Kay >> So we don't want to scare off women from listening to us who might be more conservative than you and their perspective of those passages. Jackie >> Absolutely.
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    10 分
  • Don’t Let the Culture Form You

    Don’t Let the Culture Form You
    2026/05/05
    Elizabeth Woodson Kay Daigle As Christians in a world that doesn't follow Christ, it's essential not to let the culture around us form us. God desires his children to become more and more like Jesus. Too often, however, we fail to be aware of the voices around us that are forming us instead. Elizabeth Woodson shares from her latest book, calling us to resist the culture's formation rather than the Spirit's. Elizabeth not only helps us recognize common ways we are being formed by culture, she also provides the antidote. She suggests specific spiritual practices to implement. Don't miss this important conversation. Recommended resources Elizabeth's book Habits of Resistance: 7 Ways you are being Formed By Culture and Gospel Practices To Help You Push Back BOW series: Re-imagining Discipleship Exploring Spiritual Practices podcast episode Elizabeth's website This episode is available on video if you prefer. Timestamps: 00:21 Introductions 01:23 What are you suggesting that we need to resist? 05:08 The better peace that Christ gives 14:21 The better identity Christ gives 20:03 The better justice Christ gives 24:46 Resources TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle of Beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. Welcome to our podcast today. I'm very excited to welcome Elizabeth Woodson, who has been with us before. Welcome, Elizabeth. We're so glad that you're here. Elizabeth >> Thanks for having me, Kay. It's great to be here. Kay >> Oh, you're welcome. Elizabeth is a Bible teacher, an author and a speaker. She has a degree from Dallas Seminary in Christian Education. And she has a new book out, and we're going to be talking about it today. The name of the book is Habits of Resistance. And the subtitle is Seven Ways You're Being Formed by Culture and Gospel Practices to Help You Push Back. So right there, hopefully the title will just pull people in, Elizabeth, because I think it's a great title and it helps us understand what's in the book. So it's Habits of Resistance. What are you suggesting that we need to resist? Elizabeth >> That is definitely an interesting title. We wanted to be able to draw people in with something that would make them ask that question. And so what we are wanting people to resist, or what I hope for people to resist, is being formed by the culture. And so it's the idea that our discipleship is not neutral, right? So being disciples isn't just being disciples of Jesus. We are disciples of whoever we follow. And unfortunately, I think we're in a space where maybe some of us have drifted from the path of Jesus more than we like to admit. And the fruit of our lives reflect that we're being formed by the culture. And so the encouragement through the book is to be aware of that, but also to practice these spiritual disciplines that help us resist that formation current that the culture is trying to keep us in. Kay >> Well, I certainly see the need for that. What did you see in us in the church that motivated you to write this particular book? Elizabeth >> Yeah. I saw things pop up in the place where a good portion of us like to hang out, which is social media, the gathering spaces that we have online. And so it's probably no surprise to the people who are listening that sometimes the comments sections on social media can be a bit of a dumpster fire even between Christians as we are disagreeing about things that we have difference of opinion. But in doing so, we dishonor one another as image bearers. And also is maybe just the subtle habits of what we're purchasing! And so I think there are aspects of overconsumption that we're just being pushed things and maybe our houses are full of too many things. Mine too, Kay, the Amazon boxes are showing up at my door, but the question is what is motivating us to push that buy button? And are we stewards of what God has given us? And so there's a couple other things I could list,
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    26 分
  • Healthy Churches for Women

    Healthy Churches for Women
    2026/04/21
    Laura Barringer Sadly, we've recognized over the past decade or so that healthy churches for women are not as prevalent as we'd like to believe. Too often such churches have abused, dismissed and devalued women who have much to give them. In this episode, Laura Barringer, co-author of The Church of Tov: Forming a Goodness Culture That Resists Abuses of Power and Promotes Healing, joins Dr. Kelley Mathews to discuss what healthy churches for women looks like and how to spot them. Recommended resources A Church Called Tov: Forming a Goodness Culture That Resists Abuses of Power and Promotes Healing by Scot McKnight and Laura Barringer. Recognizing Rape Culture podcast episode Caring for Women Who Struggle with Porn podcast episode Sexual Abuse in the Church podcast episode BOW's episodes on Caring Well and Church Issues This episode is available on video as well. Timestamps: 00:21 Introduction of Laura Barringer and A Church called TOV, the book she wrote with her father, Dr. Scot McNight. 02:03 Why did you partner with your father on this book? 05:39 What is tov? 08:32 How do we discern that a church is good, not toxic, for women in particular? 12:10 Elements of tov culture: compassion & empathy 18:14 What would you suggest churches do in order to value and see women? 20:21 How can a leader help her church culture avoid sexual abuse or trauma in the church? 27:02 It's much more than simply including women. 30:38 Other resources TranscriptKelley >> Welcome to Beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. I am Kelley Mathews and I am here today with Laura Barringer. She is the coauthor with her father, Scott McKnight, of several books. But today we're going to talk about tov, A Church Called Tov. I'm going to give it a little bit of publicity right here. So welcome, Laura. Thank you for taking your time with us today. Laura >> Thank you for having me. It's an honor to be with you. I'm grateful to be here and to meet you and hear a little bit more, too, about your ministry for women. Kelley >> Oh, yes. This is you'll hear more about it as we go along. But we do a lot of these interviews, really, and just provide resources for support. I would say primarily women leaders in the church. But obviously when they're online, anybody can access them. So we will hopefully add this resource for looking at churches and what they can do and why they can do—make take real, tangible steps towards being safe and healthy churches, particularly for women. And so both of your books, the other one is called Pivot, but where and that's a newer one, but we're going to stick with the older one. And it was very foundational, I think, to the conversation over the last, what, seven, eight years, maybe? I forgot exactly when it came out. Laura >> 2020. The fall of 2020. Kelley >> Only five. Oh, wow. OK. Laura >> Yeah. Kelley >> Yeah. Well, that's you know, Covid does a lot to make time disappear, I think. Laura >> It makes everything it makes everything fuzzy. Kelley >> Oh, goodness. Well, why did you partner with your father? I mean, we if anyone doesn't know Dr. McKnight is a New Testament scholar and writer and professor. And why did you guys partner up to write this book? Laura >> I wanted him to write the book. So that was the original plan. The book started as a personal story for us. In 2018, in March of 2018, a story broke up here. I live just outside of Chicago. The Chicago Tribune is the major newspaper here in the city. And it was a story about our former church, Willow Creek, our former pastor, Bill Hybels. It was a story about accusations, sexual accusations made against him by a number of women, most of whom somebody in our family knew. And it was a very disorienting, I speak of it now, but at the time it was very disorienting. It was disorienting because the church was saying the women were lying and the women were saying the church was lying.
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    32 分
  • Visual Record of Women in the Early Church

    Visual Record of Women in the Early Church
    2026/04/07
    Dr. Sandra Glahn What does ancient Christian art created in a culture of orality reveal about women in the early church? Dr. Sandra Glahn of Dallas Seminary joins Sharifa Stevens of Beyond Ordinary Women in this conversation about the visual record of women in the early church. In a time when many people were illiterate, the church used visual images to teach the people and honor those who were heroes of the faith. By studying the art of the Byzantine Era, we are able to learn more about the church of that day. The Visual Museum of Women in Christianity has created a place for us to see many of these images today and provide free access to downloadable pictures of these pieces of art. You will find this conversation both educational and a delight as you hear the amazing stories of prominent women in the early church. Sharifa Stevens Recommended resources The Visual Museum of Women in Christianity BOW Podcast episode Using the Center for Women in Leadership BOW Podcast episode Women & Worship in the Early Church This episode is available on video as well. Timestamps: 00:21 Introductions 01:19 What is the Visual Museum of Women in Christianity and how can I access the free downloads 03:39 What women in church history are found in the visual record? 08:49 Why are these names and their stories important to know? 25:06 In what countries are you looking for more visual resources? 26:10 How does visual storytelling change the way people understand theology, Scripture and churches? 30:26 How do you select the women to feature next? 35:56 Resources TranscriptSharifa >> Hello, everyone, and welcome to the Beyond Ordinary Women Podcast. I am your host for today, Sharifa Stevens, and I would like to introduce you to someone whom I admire. Dr. Sandra Glahn is a journalist and also the author, coauthor or editor of more than 20 books. She serves as Professor of Media Arts and Worship at Dallas Theological Seminary. You can discover more about Dr. Glahn on our website, BeyondOrdinaryWomen.org. Dr. Glahn's most recent endeavor is the Visual Museum of Women in Christianity which we're going to learn more about today. Welcome, Dr. Glahn. Dr. Glahn >> Thank you so much. What a pleasure to see you. Sharifa >> Well, it's a pleasure to see you always. I wanted to just jump in to questions about the Visual Museum of Women in Christianity because I'm a newbie to this subject, and I'm sure there would be plenty of people in the audience who are intrigued and want to know more. So let's get started. Dr. Glahn >> Let's do it. Sharifa >> How would you describe the museum to someone encountering it for the first time? Dr. Glahn >> It's a place to get free high quality photos of women and the history of the church, particularly the early church and Byzantine eras. Maybe in 4.0 we'll be looking at every century of the church, but really it's focused much more on women in the early church. And it's a resource with free downloads where you don't have to ask permission. You don't have to say where you got it. Everything is a work for hire with photographers so that women are much more easy, much more easily accessed if you want to include visuals with a presentation. What we found, well, there's probably more than you need it just for a short explanation, but Sharifa >> no. Dr. Glahn >> we found that when we were looking to add women to PowerPoints and talks and people were looking for them for sermons, they're hidden behind paywalls. The art was paywalled or it was clipart. So it was one extreme or the other, the really high quality stuff. You know, it was illegal. If it was if it was even there. And so this is an effort to make it super accessible. Sharifa >> When you say early church, just for those of us who might not have a clear timeline of the Byzantine era, what are the years that we're talking about? Dr. Glahn >> So early church, of course,
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    38 分
  • The Gift of Anger

    The Gift of Anger
    2026/03/24
    Jamie Grant Heather Parker In this second episode with counselors Jamie Grant and Heather Parker, they talk about the gift of anger, how it is a gift to us as we learn to notice what's going on within our hearts when it arises. In this conversation they explain where anger comes from, inward and outward anger and the possibility that anger is masking other losses. Connect to Episode 1: Does My Anger Matter to God? if you missed it. Recommended resources The Voice of a Heart: A Call to Full Living by Chip Dodd Tim Keller's sermon, The Healing of Anger The Faces of Rage by David Damico (out of publication but used books available online) Heather Parker at waterstonecounseling.org Jamie Grant at MetanoiaDallas.com This episode is available on video as well. Timestamps: 00:22 Introductions 01:10 Summary of Episode 1 03:33 Understanding where anger comes from 09:10 Outward and inward anger 16:15 Which is worse---outward or inner anger? 21:06 Losses can underlie anger. 24:38 Anger can be a gift. 35:47 Resources TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle of Beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. Welcome to our podcast and video episode. We have today guests who have returned. Two weeks ago in our podcast we welcomed Jamie Grant and Heather Parker, who are both licensed professional counselors. We have been talking about anger. We've been talking about all sorts of things, and we're extending that today to a second session because there was so much information that they gave us that we want to dig a little bit deeper into anger, particularly as Christians. So, Heather, tell us a little bit summarize a little bit of what we've already heard and talked about before we go into a new area of anger. Heather >> Sure. So in the last one, we talked about the perception. Well, first we talked about anger—how do we see that in the image of God and really highlighting that God is slow to anger. There’s a real there's a lot of restraint and it's not long lasting. That is the truth of how we see anger in God. That's not always how we're taught. Sometimes we're taught that he is a rageful God but Scripture tells us otherwise. So we kind of hit a little highlight on that. We spoke of the perception of anger in the church—that oftentimes anger can be viewed as sin or it's bad. And if it's sinful and it's bad, then we're bad. Yeah. Jamie, you can jump in at any time too. Yeah. We talked a little bit about just the perception of it really highlighting the difference between God-given anger that shows us something's not okay. It exposes what we're passionate about and shows us something's not okay. It's not sitting well with me and can eventually inform how we want to approach that. And really highlight the difference between that and a rage or acting out or the quick-tempered what we often see in families and society. And even often in our churches. We talked about, yeah, just how anger—sometimes people in leadership will want to make sure that people stay away from their anger. And that comes out in an element of control and that can look a lot of different ways. But overall, the messaging around anger as being bad or negative starts really young and is often widespread, especially in Christian circles. Yeah, anything I leave out, Jamie? Jamie >> I think that was a great recap. I think what made it a nice kind of segue into what we talk about today is you know, if there's, as you were saying, like these beliefs around anger as being bad or if I'm taught anger is bad and therefore I internalize this message that I'm bad because I'm experiencing this emotion of anger. There's also some other messages that we get as children because we're you know, this isn't going to be a parent finger-pointing episode or session. But we are—we’re sinful people raised by sinful parents in a sinful world. So we're going to get messages around our emotions based on how we're brought up.
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    38 分
  • Does My Anger Matter to God?

    Does My Anger Matter to God?
    2026/03/10
    Jamie Grant Counselors Jamie Grant and Heather Parker answer the question, "Does my anger matter to God?" They discuss about how it is so often misunderstood in the church in this conversation with Dr. Kay Daigle. Heather Parker Because anger can masquerade as depression, we often fail to deal with it correctly. Trauma in children may cause anger that leads to other issues as they become adults. This insightful conversation can help us recognize anger and appropriately get help to deal with it. This is an important topic for not only Christian leaders as they help others, but it is for all of us, knowing that we all deal with anger and that it matters to God. Recommended resources The Voice of the Heart by Chip Dodd Tim Keller's sermon, The Healing of Anger The Faces of Rage by David Damico The Dance of Anger: A Woman's Guide to Changing the Patterns of Intimate Relationships by Harriet Lerner Healing Developmental Trauma: How Early Trauma Affects Self-Regulation, Self-Image and the Capacity for Relationship by Laurence Heller, PhD and Aline LaPierre, PsyD BOW episodes on lament. This episode is available on video as well. Timestamps: 00:21 Introductions 02:34 God's anger 08:28 How does being made in God's image change how we think about human anger? 10:37 How do Christians often perceive anger? 20:42 How can anger become a tool in the church for control? 25:39 What actually is anger? 32:10 Processing anger 33:41 Resources TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle of Beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. Welcome to this podcast and video episode. Today we're talking about anger with our guests, Heather Parker and Jamie Grant. Welcome, ladies. Jamie >> Thank you. Heather >> Thanks for having us. Kay >> Well, I'm excited about this conversation, and I feel like this is an important one right now. But let me just introduce these gals quickly. Jamie is a licensed professional counselor, and she graduated with a degree in counseling from Dallas Seminary. And she specializes in working with adults with complex trauma. She practices in a private practice here in North Dallas. And Heather is in Birmingham. And she practices at Waterstone Counseling. She's also a licensed professional counselor and supervisor and she specializes in helping people overcome trauma. So both of them work with people with trauma issues and that's how we started talking about what to talk about. And they brought up anger as a possible topic. And I was so delighted that you did that, because our society is just full of so much anger right now. I don't think I've ever seen so much anger in my lifetime. And I'm old. So, you know, this is this is a very unique time, at least for the last, you know, century, I would say as far as anger is concerned. There's just a lot of hatred and a lot of anger toward anyone that doesn't agree with whoever it is. So all sides have anger. And so let's just talk a little bit about anger. Let's begin with us being Christians. I think it's great to set the standard for where God comes from on anger, because we know God gets angry. God talks about God's anger and he talks about it in the Bible. So what does the Scripture show us about God’s anger, You want to start us out, Jamie? Jamie >> Sure. And without, you know, having a kind of list of the different references, just kind of a general idea of the God's anger in the Scripture. I mean, so many times I hear people or I have heard people delineate or make this delineation between the God of the Old Testament and the God of the New Testament. The God of the Old Testament seems so full of anger and wrath. And, you know, Jesus comes along and has like this compassion. And so I think it's really important to remember the God of the Old Testament is the same. God is the God in the New Testament. And, you know, Jesus, God and the Holy Spirit are all one. So there is no delineation; God is not divided in himself....
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    37 分
  • Valuing the “Boring” Chapters of the Bible

    Valuing the “Boring” Chapters of the Bible
    2026/02/24
    Dr. Nika Spaulding Do you value the "boring" parts of the Bible? If you've ever read through the Bible or have encountered sections that you might consider boring, this episode will give you reasons to care about them. According to BOW's guest speaker, Dr. Nika Spaulding, Leviticus, the genealogies, and other scriptures can actually be places of learning, encouragement and joy. Her conversation with Dr. Kay Daigle will blow your mind as you see the riches that these passages hold. Recommended resources BOW's Media List - search for Nika BOW's Studying & Teaching the Bible This episode is available on video if you prefer it. Timestamps: 00:20 Introduction to Nika and the topic 01:14 Who needs to hear this? 04:31 Scriptures that tell us we should read all parts of the Bible 06:32 What makes the details of the tabernacle so interesting? 14:40 What about the genealogies? 25:51 Best ways to read the Bible 29:03 Resources TranscriptKay >> Welcome to the Beyond Ordinary Women Podcast and video. I'm Kay Daigle your host. And today I'm joined by Dr. Nika Spaulding. Nika >> Wow. The Doctor! Wow! Kay >> Yeah, well, we are so happy about that. And congratulations to you on that. That's a big deal. Nika >> Thank you, Dr. Kay. Kay >> You're welcome. Well, Nika is a frequent guest. We have her often because she always has so many good things to say. And she has a Th.M. from DTS as well as a D.Min. from Northern Seminary. Today we are going to talk about valuing the so-called boring chapters of the Bible.

    Nika >> Yeah.Kay >> Now, Nika, who needs to hear this? Nika >> Everyone. Everyone needs to hear. And I mean that! You know, you and I always talk about what is it we want to talk about? What do we want to bring to Beyond Ordinary Women. And it tends to just kind of grow out of whatever research I'm doing at that time, whatever I'm studying and learning. And right now I'm doing this thing where I'm teaching through each book of the Bible, one chapter at a time. So I'm halfway on a little bit more than halfway through Exodus. We've done all of Genesis. We've done all of Exodus. And it made me realize how tempting it would be to skip some chapters. Like, if I'm being honest, there's some chapters and I'm like, “Huh, I'm not as excited about this chapter as I would, you know, Abraham sacrificing Isaac or whatever.” There's just certain parts of the Bible you think, “Really?” And yet I have found because I'm forcing myself to do it, I'm discovering these so-called boring passages like genealogies, the tabernacle instructions, places like that. What I'm discovering is actually they are critical chapters to one, our understanding of the Bible. But also there's so much like good juice to squeeze out of that fruit for our spiritual formation and for our development. That shouldn't surprise us if Scripture tells us that all Scripture is God breathed inspired by God and useful for these things. And so I really do believe this is one of those videos for everybody, whether you're teaching through the Bible, studying the Bible, coming to the Bible for the first time, confused about the so-called boring parts of the Bible. This is a video for you. Kay >> Yes. I wish I had had this video when I started with my group, that is reading through the Bible in two years, because we've already made it through a lot of those chapters. And I thought you were very positive just to say not as excited about these chapters because I think many of us aren't even excited at all. Nika >> About, you know. Kay >> We just want to get through these chapters. This gal who is reading through the Bible with this group told us that she puts her finger under every name because in the genealogies or other times where they're lists of people just so that she reads every single name and doesn't just skip over it. Nika >> Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's great. I not only do I teach through it,
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    31 分