While this week’s episode is airing in a post-2024 election world, it was recorded prior to the election – so you’ll get to hear Val & Emerson’s thoughts + advice for their future selves…which is now advice for their current selves. 😵‍💫🤪

This episode runs the gamut from Dancing With The Stars & Bad Monkey, some of Emerson’s lore, whatever TF touching grass means, and our main event – navigating dating and attachment styles in the app era.

So, whether you’re looking for a good TV or music rec, want to reconnect with your own embarrassing middle school memories, or need help navigating the treacherous waters of dating apps, we’ve got you covered.

This episode covers:

• 01:20 - Val & Emerson’s pre-election thoughts + advice for their future selves
• 05:26 - Tea & Crumpets - Dancing With The Stars & Bad Monkey on Apple TV
• 10:39 - The Lore - Emerson’s self-proclaimed “very embarrassing and earnest story” of her first day of 6th grade
• 14:38 - The DSM - Attachment Styles in the App Era
• 44:07 - Now That’s What I Call…Okaaaay
• 46:04 - Emerson’s Pick: “doomsday” by Lizzy McAlpine
• 48:43 - Valerie’s Pick: “Control” by Poe
• 49:50 - Wait…What? – What does the slang phrase “touch grass” actually mean?
• 52:14 - Fire Dumpster Phoenix – The e-learning platform Flowdiary & UK researchers getting funding to create a vaccine that prevents ovarian cancer

Resources + Stuff Mentioned in This Episode:

• Bad Monkey on Apple TV
• Dancing With The Stars
• Doomsday by Lizzy McAlpine
• Control by Poe
• Flowdiary
• Funding has been awarded to researchers in the UK to create a vaccine that prevents ovarian cancer!

Connect with Us:

• Send a story or ask for advice: butforrealpod@gmail.com
• But For Real on IG: @butforrealpod
• Now That's What I Call... OKAAAAY Playlist
• The Gaia Center on IG: @thegaiacenter
• Val on IG: @valkaymartin
• The Gaia Center website: www.gaiacenter.co

DISCLAIMER: But For Real Podcast is not a substitute for individualized mental health treatment or healthcare. This podcast is solely for entertainment and educational purposes. If you are in crisis, please utilize crisis support services, such as the Crisis Text Line (Text START to 741741 in the US) or the 988 Suicide & Crisis Lifeline: (Call 988 in the US), or visit

You can’t watch more than 10 minutes of news these days without hearing some reference to AI (our bff, artificial intelligence)— and it’s popping up everywhere from celebrities and politics to music, shopping, and healthcare. In this ep, we’re breaking down the pros and cons, ethical considerations, and future directions of AI specifically within mental healthcare and therapy— and it is a JUICY one, y’all. And of course as always, we also get into a lot more!

This episode covers:

• 00:54 - Intro: Emerson seeing Chappel Roan and Val’s Texas Trip
• 03:46 - Tea & Crumpets: The Giver of Stars by Jojo Moyes and Monsters: The Lyle and Erik Menendez Story on Netflix
• 08:11 - Step Into My Office: Navigating family estrangement when wanting to stay close to all members involved
• 13:36 - The Lore: Shea Wingate’s experiences with grief and learning to befriend the “grief monster”
• 20:16 - The DSM: AI & Mental Health – Advantages, Dangers, Ethical Considerations, and Future Directions
• 46:58 - Now That’s What I Call…Ooookay
• 48:16 - Val’s Pick: “Only Hope” by Mandy Moore
• 50:34 - Emerson’s Pick: “Be Careful With Yourself” by Julia Jacklin
• 52:34 - Wait…What: WTF is a kiki?!
• 54:30 - Fire Dumpster Phoenix: Cats ‘hired’ to motivate security guards in Philippines and Thailand becomes first Southeastern Asian country to legalize marriage equality!!

Resources + Stuff Mentioned in This Episode:

• Book: The Giver of Stars by Jojo Moyes
• Monsters: The Lyle and Erik Menendez Story on Netflix
• Shea Wingate – The Grief Girlie
• Woebot
• Wysa
• X2AI
• Headspace Care (formerly known as Ginger)
• Flamme
• 60 Minutes story
• Can AI Replace Therapists? A Psychiatrist Explains
• Fixing My Brain with Automated Therapy by Jacob Gellar
• Only Hope by Mandy Moore
• Be Careful With Yourself by Julia Jacklin
• Cats ‘hired’ to motivate security guards in Philippines
• Thailand becomes first Southeastern Asian country to legalize marriage equality!!

AI Journaling Apps:

• Rosebud

Today’s guest, The Gaia Center’s very own resident grief-expert Kalaway Voss, shares wisdom and tangible ways that we can move through grief, whether it’s the death of a loved one, a more ambiguous loss such as the ending of a relationship, or anything in between.

About Kalaway Voss

Kalaway Voss is a mental health therapist at The Gaia Center in Nashville, TN. She completed her Masters in Clinical Mental Health Counseling at The Chicago School of Professional Psychology. Kalaway specializes in working with adults navigating grief and loss, anxiety, depression, complex trauma, and folks who are grappling with existential questions related to life, death, and meaning. She approaches healing from a mind/body/spirit perspective (including certification in Level 1 Reiki) and aims to help her clients feel empowered in their personal wisdom, tell their unique stories, and live bravely. Kalaway spends a lot of her time drying flowers and working with the restorative and healing properties of dried plants, herbs, and flowers.

This episode covers:

• 03:00 - Tea & Crumpets: How To Die Alone, The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, and The ex-Files Rewatch Podcast
• 06:36 - Step Into My Office: Kalaway’s advice on coping with the loss of a best friend
• 09:43 - The DSM: All Things Grief – What drew Kalaway to want to specialize in grief therapy, healthy grief, cultural and societal influences, and tips for connecting with/processing grief
• 34:54 - Now That’s What I Call….Okayyyy: You’re Gonna Go Far by Noah Kahan, A Little Bit of Everything by Dawes, and Landslide by Fleetwood Mac
• 44:37 - Fire Dumpster Phoenix: Non-traditional Ways to Honor and Ceremonialize Death
• 50:24 - Rapid Fire Q&A on Kalway’s perspectives of grief

Resources + Stuff Mentioned in This Episode:

• How To Die Alone on Hulu
• Secret Lives of Mormon Wives on Hulu
• The ex-Files Rewatch Podcast with Jenny Owen Youngs + Kristin Russo
• You're Gonna Go Far by Noah Kahan
• A Little Bit of Everything by Dawes
• Landslide by Fleetwood Mac
• Big Fish (2003)

Connect / Work with Kalaway:

• https://gaiacenter.co/meet-kalaway

Connect with Us:

• Send a story or ask for advice: butforrealpod@gmail.com
• But For Real on IG: @butforrealpod
• The Gaia Center on IG: @thegaiacenter
• Val on IG: @valkaymartin
• The Gaia Center website: