Episode 11 in the serial series ‘Farewell Evangelicalism’, designed to name malformed pillars that shape evangelical/conservative Christian thought and beliefs.

One of the counters to evangelical community is to demonstrate the expansive nature of belonging and liberation. Where evangelicalism demands assimilation to specific morals and theological persuasions, catching a glimpse of what freedom and living out your whole self looks like goes a long way to help make the switch and ultimately leave life-taking church community. In this episode my guests discuss some of the impediments in church community such as fear, and where we can look to replace harmful demands. Freedom to be your whole self, liberation from malformed theological systems, and ultimately community where you can belong and live as your true self without the mask are all out there.

Sometimes it just takes a little nudge in search of belonging.

Episode 11 Show Notes

(00:00) Introduction with Rohadi (5:24) Sarah Westfall intro and her story. (7:15) When belonging starts getting complicated…. (10:44) A conversation on authenticity vs performance. (14:40) Leaving community behind and the loneliness it brings. (18:04) Resisting the attention economy. (25:00) Countering the tool of ‘fear’. (29:00) Interlude (29:44) Poetry Interlude with Sharifa (30:50) Intro Sharifa Steven and chatting about her latest book. (33:25) Holding the tension for liberation; seeking the ancestors. (37:15) The legacy of the ancestors and what it means to our liberation. (40:28) Naming the hope that is to come and what it looks like. (56:18) Outro

Featuring your host: Rohadi Nagassar (he/him)

Rohadi’s books can be found here, including his latest publication, When We Belong. Reclaiming Christianity on the Margins. Visit his online church community: https://abeautifultable.ca/

Sharifa Stevens

Sharifa Stevens is a writer, poet, speaker, and singer. She is the daughter of Jamaican immigrants, born and raised in New York, and currently resides with her family in Dallas, Texas. She graduated from Columbia University in New York with a bachelor’s degree in African American Studies before earning a master’s in theology from Dallas Theological Seminary. Sharifa aspires to use writing as a vehicle that moves readers to intersect with the sacred and the honest. Her latest book is When We Talk to God: A Powerful New Book of Prayers and Poems for Black Women. SharifaStevens.com | IG: SharifaWrites

Sarah E. Westfall

Sarah Westfall’s lastest book is called The Way of Belonging: Reimagining Who We Are and How We Relate (available in both print, digital, and audio formats). Sign up for her Substack newsletter, Human Together, or check out her podcast (which happens to go by the same name). Sarah_Westfall on Instagram.

Bumper music by Daniel Wheat; Intro by Jesse Peters

Episode 10 in the serial series ‘Farewell Evangelicalism’, designed to name malformed pillars that shape evangelical/conservative Christian thought and beliefs. The hope is to catalyze pathways for folks to leave this faith tradition that does more harm than good. Sexuality and gender constructs are a significant pillars in evangelical identity. Any body that pushes against a white cis-gendered, straight able-bodied male gaze is a threat.

In this episode, we discuss trans identity and liberation. Featuring Celeste Irwin and Dr. Che Roberto, two voices speaking on trans identity, offering us a picture of a wide ethic of liberation.

Why should this conversation matter if you’re not trans? Because you’re a curious human! In this moment, 2025, trans folks are the primary target of conservative politicians and religious leaders, who better to learn from on what liberation looks like than the very folks furthest from the center? So through the example of Jesus where the last shall be first.

Episode 10 Show Notes

(00:00) Introduction with Rohadi (05:34) Celeste Irwin and her story. (12:00) Finding liberation escaping religious community. (16:00) Finding her whole self. (18:40) Naming malformed policies in conservative ideology/Christian right. (34:24) Pivot to Dr. Roberto (35:12) Intro Dr. Roberto Espinoza and his story. (39:20) Finding home on the land. (42:00) Finding healing in the body. (47:20) A trans take on the resurrection and signals for future hope. (57:25) The threat to our democracy and the power of stories. (1:01:00) Where is the light?

Featuring your host: Rohadi Nagassar (he/him)

Rohadi’s books can be found here, including his latest publication, When We Belong. Reclaiming Christianity on the Margins. Visit his online church community: https://abeautifultable.ca/

Celeste Irwin (she/her) – Trans Activist and Writer

Celeste is a transgender, lesbian woman. She is a writer and advocate for transgender rights and inclusion in Christian spaces. Having survived an abusive church, she also writes about spiritual abuse. Visit her website/Substack and find her on BlueSky.

Dr. Roberto Che Espinoza (he/him) – Public Theologian and Author

Dr. Roberto Che Espinoza is a Transgender & Latinx public scholar, using imaginative narrative to steward more ethical futures. Find more about his resources and exoertise on his website: https://robertoche.com/. Find his Substack and Instagram.

Bumper music by Daniel Wheat; Intro by Jesse Peters

Episode 9 in the serial season called ‘Farewell Evangelicalism’ is now live!

In this episode, we discuss the embodied work necessary after losing core elements in our life like faith. We name pathways to help process leaving church, including the loss of community, and the mountain of grief that follows.

Episode 9 Show Notes

(00:00) Introduction with Rohadi on grief and loss. (04:24) Grief Coach – Mandy Capehart (32:00) Intro Meghan Crozier (46:00) Losing community after leaving church community. (56:20) Components that help grieve. (59:00) Cautions for folks entering the deconstruction space.

Featuring your host, Rohadi (from Rohadi.com)

Rohadi’s books can be found here, including his latest publication, When We Belong. Reclaiming Christianity on the Margins. Visit his online church community: https://abeautifultable.ca/

Mandy Capehart – Grief Coach and Podcaster Mandy Capehart (she/her/hers) is the founder of the Restorative Grief model. Find more about Mandy and her coaching program at https://www.mandycapehart.com/. Find her latest podcast episodes and her publication on grief.

Meghan Crozier – Community Catalyst and Podcaster Visit Meghan over at The Pursuing Life! Meghan lives in the Pacific Northwest. Meghan curates space to help folks wrestle with questions on deconstruction and what spiritual growth looks like. She writes about topics like faith deconstruction, spirituality, equity, justice, race, mental health, and religion. She also explore the same themes and topics on the Thereafter Podcast with co-host, Cortland Coffey.

Bumper music by Daniel Wheat; Intro by Jesse Peters Find Dr. Hillary McBride’s Holy Hurt podcast. Data on homicides and evangelicalism here.

Featuring: Rohadi Nagassar, Janice Lagata, LetGregLive, Kristian A. Smith

The term: Deconstruction defined in Rohadi’s book, When We Belong, is: the work to reclaim what gives life; discard what does not; and create beautiful stories. Welcome to Episode 8 where we venture through the land of religious deconstruction, only this time through the Black and brown church experiences.

In this episode we hear from Janice Lagata who shares her story about the eventual implosion of Hillsong New York. Followed by Greg, who provides some insight on the work of deconstruction and decolonization out of a Black church experience. Lastly, Kristian A Smith and Rohadi talk about what faith can look like beyond the gaze of white hegemony. All this and more in Episode 8.

Episode 8 Show Notes

(00:00-04:00) Introduction with Rohadi (04:24) Janice Lagata (09:00) Broaching the Death of Hillsong New York (26:00) Interrogating the deconstruction space on socials. (29:40) Intro to Greg (31:00) Greg intro (34:00) Black Deconstruction (39:20) Christian supremacy (44:00) Intro Kristian A Smith (45:00) A different take on deconstruction. (53:20) The weird in Black and brown church traditions. (57:00) Reclamation project. Where to find life. (1:02:00) on decolonizing

Featuring your host, Rohadi (from Rohadi.com)

Rohadi’s books can be found here, including his latest publication, When We Belong. Reclaiming Christianity on the Margins. Visit his online church community: https://abeautifultable.ca/

Janice Lagata – Musician and Podcaster Find more from Janice on her website. Stream her latest album “Toxic Empathy” on Spotify or AppleMusic.

Greg – Muscian and Teacher Educator. Baritenor. Musical Theatre Enthusiast. Sinfonian. B.M.Ed, M.S., Ed.S.

Kristian A Smith – Pastor and Podcaster Find him on Instagram. Community Builder; Founder & Pastor @tfc.virtual; Host @holysmokesmovement; Curator of Greatest Commandment Theology. Find him over at kristianasmith.com

Bumper music by Janice Lagata; Intro by Jesse Peters

Featuring the voices of: Rohadi, Scott Coley, Lamar Hardwick, and Robert G Callahan

Episode 7 on white supremacy, a crucial conversation for churchgoers, particularly white churchgoers, to generate awareness to the ways white supremacist thinking invades thought and beliefs. Indeed, white supremacist theology is in the DNA, a feature not an add-on, of nearly every denomination across the Americas. We’ll try to pinpoint some of the most egregious forms in this episode, with a hope that listeners will become alert to the ways you own formation/beliefs are filtered through racist understandings of the world around us.

We discuss biblical examples used to support white superiority and how common they are; learn how ableism is a precursor to white supremacy; and end with naming the weird in white evangelicalism, with a side of hopeful alternatives to find your way out.

Show Notes:

(00:00) – Welcome (01:00) – Rohadi introduces to white supremacy and why it matters to interrogate our formation, from 2020, CRT, to DEI. (10:40) – Scott Coley describes one mechanism of malformed hermeneutics; how to twist the Bible to fit white supremacist narratives. (19:00) – Intro to Lamar Hardwick and how ableism fuels racist views. (24:00) – Intro to Robert G Callahan (25:40) – Robert Callahan speaks to his experience in Texas. (27:45) – Robert describes all of the ‘weird’ in white evangelical churches. (54:00) – Unpacking righteous anger. (1:00:00) – Outro

Featuring your host, Rohadi (from Rohadi.com)

Rohadi’s books can be found here, including his latest publication, When We Belong. Reclaiming Christianity on the Margins.

Guests in Episode 7

Scholar/Author – Scott Coley Scott Coley Scott M. Coley holds a Ph.D. in philosophy from Purdue University, a Master’s degree in systematic theology from the University of Notre Dame, and a B.A. in philosophy and English from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. His research interests include philosophy of religion, moral epistemology and political philosophy. His book is entitled, Ministers of Propaganda: Truth, Power, and the Ideology of the Religious Right from Wm. B. Eerdmans Publishing.

Author/Pastor – Lamar Hardwick Dr. Hardwick is a father, husband, pastor, and author. He holds a Master of Divinity degree from Emory University as well as a Doctor of Ministry degree from Liberty University School of Divinity. He is a graduate of the Yale School of Divinity Clergy Scholar Program and a 2017 graduate of Georgia Forward’s Young Gamechangers Program, which included 50 of the state of Georgia’s top thinkers, innovators, and leaders under the age of 40. He is currently a PhD at Union Institute and University in Cincinatti, Ohio. Find him on Instagram

Author/Attorney – Robert Callahan Robert Callahan is a prolific writer and accomplished attorney, dedicated to his practice at Callahan & King in the heart of Waco, Texas. He earned a Bachelor of Arts in Political Science from Gonzaga University and a Juris Doctorate at Baylor University School of Law, where he now serves as adjunct professor of Integrating Faith and Legal Practice. His latest book is called, Fire in the Whole: Embracing Our Righteous Anger with white Christianity and Reclaiming Our Wholeness.

Bumper music by Rubix; Intro by Jesse Peters

Let’s settle in friends for some quiet time…. Just kidding. Episode 6 in this serial series interrogating the malformed pillars in evangelicalism is here. We examine one of the most important elements in evangelical belief systems–perhaps THE most important religious icon–the Bible.

Evangelicals claim the Bible has supreme authority in designing beliefs. It’s the “Bible alone”, used with complete disregard for malformed interpretations. You may be wondering why chat about the Bible mid-way through this series and not at the very start. After all, isn’t the Bible central to evangelicalism? It is, but not in the manner you might think. The Bible has been distorted to become a tool for religious propaganda that advances the interests of white evangelicalism. In other words, the Bible is used to define conservative and white supremacist worldviews, and believers stuck in the pew of these churches must adopt specific interpretations or risk being excommunicated (if evangelicals had such a thing.) Malformed beliefs like biblical inerrancy and literalism are not, ironically, biblical, yet are core attributes used to keep the faithful in line.

Let’s talk about it, Episode 6 is here.

Show Chapters

(00:00-01:00) Introduction (02:30) Rohadi on why we’re interrogating the validity of biblical tradition in evangelicalism. (02:33-14:00) Quiet time. Just kidding. Unpacking the ways evangelicals twist the Bible to fit their own devices. (14:00-20:05) Unpacking one of the malformed pillars is used to justify: Patriarchy w/ Liz Jenkins. (20:05-22:00) Intro to Ryan Canty – Author of Deweaponize. (22:00-24:20) Naming malformed pillars including inerrancy and the Chicago Statement (24:20-33:00) Unpacking the Chicago Statement with Liz Grant (33:40) Ways evangelicals distort scripture using literalism wrong. (40:11) Rohadi and authoritarianism and the Bible. (43:40) Ryan on, What are the possibilities of change? (50:15) Possibilities of how we can reclaim biblical interpretation with Liz Grant. (59:50) Liz Jenkins with the final word on interpretation. (1:02:02) Outro

Featuring your host, Rohadi (from Rohadi.com).

Rohadi’s books can be found here, including his latest publication, When We Belong. Reclaiming Christianity on the Margins.

Special Guests in Episode 6:

Ryan Canty – Author of Deweaponize. Re-examining how we read the Bible in pursuit of a more Christlike interpretation Former Calvinist theology nerd on a journey to de-weaponize the Bible and love others like Jesus. Find him on Substack | Instagram

Liz Charlotte Grant – Author of KNOCK AT THE SKY: Seeking God in Genesis After Losing Faith in the Bible. Liz is an award-winning nonfiction writer based in Colorado, USA. She is also an online columnist for The Christian Century. Her essays and op-eds have also been published in outlets such as the Huffington Post, Religion News Service, the Revealer, Hippocampus Magazine, Brevity, Sojourners, Christianity Today, US Catholic, National Catholic Reporter, and elsewhere. Find Liz on Instagram and Threads

Liz Jenkins – Author of Nice Churchy Patriarchy. If you’d like to read more, check out her now-occasional blog, her Substack, and/or her book Nice Churchy Patriarchy. Find Liz via Instagram: @lizcoolj and @postevangelicalprayers.

Bumper music by Daniel Wheat.