In this episode, Mike and Lisa delve into a recent critique of their training methods regarding laser hair removal, specifically addressing concerns raised by a laser supplier about their promotion of higher fluences and external cooling techniques. Mike & Lisa clarify the science behind pulse widths, fluences, and the importance of targeting stem cells rather than just the hair itself. Mike and Lisa also touch on the implications of using higher fluences on handpiece longevity and the overall effectiveness of treatments, encouraging practitioners to prioritize results and client satisfaction.

KEY TAKEAWAYS

• The relationship between pulse width and fluence is crucial in laser hair removal. A higher fluence can lead to longer pulse widths, but the key factor is ensuring that the energy delivered is sufficient to heat the stem cells effectively, regardless of the pulse width.

• Pre-cooling the skin with ice packs before treatment can significantly reduce pain and the risk of unwanted side effects, such as blistering and pigmentation changes. This allows practitioners to use higher fluences safely.

• The denaturation time, which is the time required to irreversibly damage the target cells, is more critical than the pulse width alone. The temperature and duration of exposure are what ultimately determine the effectiveness of the treatment.

• The podcast discusses criticism of their training methods, particularly regarding the use of higher fluences. They argue that using higher fluences with proper cooling leads to better results, even if it may reduce the lifespan of the handpieces.

• There are common misconceptions in the industry about starting with low fluences and gradually increasing them. The podcast emphasizes the importance of starting at the correct fluency from the beginning to achieve effective results without unnecessary delays.

BEST MOMENTS

"We promote skin cooling, higher fluence, which in diodes equals longer pulse width. They're saying that will be bad for the treatment because they believe you should have a short pulse width."

"If you use a lower fluence, that means you're firing in less energy. And less energy means lower temperatures. Lower temperatures mean you need much longer times to cook the cells."

"The temperature of the hair is, like I said, pretty much irrelevant. What is important is getting the right amount of energy into the hair."

"If you're going to end up sitting there with a lot of disgruntled clients... then that's not good for your business or your reputation."

"The higher the fluence, the shorter the time you need to denature the cells. And that's why the pulse width becomes unimportant."

ABOUT THE HOSTS

Mike began his career in medical lasers in 1986 with a physics degree and a post-grad in bioengineering. He helped develop the scar-free removal of tattoos using a Q-Switched Ruby Laser in Glasgow, and the world's first IPL system. Known well in the industry for his hard truths, no BS attitude and logical answers. As the author of three books, articles for medical journals, a well read blog, a Laser Protection Advisor and contributor to the BMLA, Mike is the Laser Guru.

Lisa's claim to laser fame is being Mike's daughter. Growing up with lasers and never avoiding a physics lesson from her Dad, it was natural to enter the industry. Leaving a corporate career with a baby to jump into self employed life came with challenges. Despite that Lisa has been well recognised for her teaching style, practical tips, bringing the compassion to the science, and laser mentoring.

Instagram: @dermalase_lasertraining

https://mikemurphyblog.com

https://www.dermalasetraining.com

In this episode, Mike and Lisa interview Caroline McLean, an advanced skin practitioner from Skinology in Glasgow, who shares her extensive 20-year experience in the industry. They discuss Caroline's unique approach to using IPL for pigmentation, which contrasts with Mike and Lisa's established protocols. Caroline elaborates on her combination therapies, including the use of a cold laser bionic and CO2 treatments.

KEY TAKEAWAYS

• Caroline McLean utilises a unique IPL protocol for treating pigmentation, which involves higher fluence settings and double passes, contrasting with traditional methods. This approach allows for immediate darkening of the pigment, indicating effective treatment.

• Cooling the skin before, during, and after IPL treatments is crucial. Caroline emphasises the need for thorough cooling to minimise erythema and edema, ensuring client comfort and optimal results.

• Clients are advised on aftercare, including cooling the skin, avoiding acids and retinoids, and using recovery balm. This helps manage expectations regarding the healing process and potential side effects like tenderness and swelling.

• Caroline integrates various treatments, such as LED therapy (Dermalux) post-IPL, to enhance healing and monitor skin reactions. This holistic approach combines skincare, lifestyle factors, and treatment modalities for better outcomes.

• A significant part of Caroline's practice involves educating clients about their skin conditions, treatment processes, and realistic outcomes. This includes discussing the importance of skin preparation and the potential need for multiple sessions to achieve desired results.

BEST MOMENTS

"I will usually do two passes and kind of cross hatch them. I want to see that pigment getting darker."

"I don't treat darker skin tones, so I wouldn't treat any sort of Asian skin tones or any mixed skin tone with an IPL."

"The biggest combination therapy is combining your skincare with your treatments with your lifestyle and your holistic sort of side of it as well."

"I want to know how they're going to respond to something. If they then come back to me and their skin is not recovering, then that's on me."

"I think it would have to be my severe inflammatory acne clients, being able to help somebody heal their skin is pretty amazing."

ABOUT THE HOSTS

Mike began his career in medical lasers in 1986 with a physics degree and a post-grad in bioengineering. He helped develop the scar-free removal of tattoos using a Q-Switched Ruby Laser in Glasgow, and the world's first IPL system. Known well in the industry for his hard truths, no BS attitude and logical answers. As the author of three books, articles for medical journals, a well read blog, a Laser Protection Advisor and contributor to the BMLA, Mike is the Laser Guru.

Lisa's claim to laser fame is being Mike's daughter. Growing up with lasers and never avoiding a physics lesson from her Dad, it was natural to enter the industry. Leaving a corporate career with a baby to jump into self employed life came with challenges. Despite that Lisa has been well recognised for her teaching style, practical tips, bringing the compassion to the science, and laser mentoring.

Instagram: @dermalase_lasertraining

https://mikemurphyblog.com

https://www.dermalasetraining.com

In today's episode, Mike and Lisa dive into the fundamental concepts of laser physics through a fun "Explain Like I'm Five" format. They explore key terms such as fluence, pulse width, and wavelength, breaking down complex ideas into simple analogies. Mike explains how fluence, measured in joules per square centimeter, is crucial for achieving effective results in laser treatments, while pulse width is likened to the duration of a bus journey delivering energy to the skin.

KEY TAKEAWAYS

• Fluence refers to the concentration of energy delivered to the skin during laser treatments, measured in joules per square centimeter. It is crucial for achieving effective results in procedures targeting hair follicles, blood vessels, and pigmentation.

• There is a minimum threshold fluence that must be exceeded for a treatment to be effective, as well as a maximum threshold to avoid causing damage to surrounding skin tissues. Finding the right range of fluence is essential for successful outcomes.

• Pulse width (or pulse duration) is the length of time that energy is delivered to the skin. It can vary significantly depending on the type of laser used, and it does not directly correlate with the reaction time of the tissues being treated.

• Wavelength determines the color of the light used in treatments and is measured in nanometers. Different wavelengths penetrate the skin to varying depths, which affects their effectiveness in targeting specific structures like hair follicles or blood vessels.

• The concept of useful penetration depth combines both wavelength and fluence. It is important for ensuring that the energy delivered can effectively reach and treat the intended target within the skin, especially for deeper structures.

BEST MOMENTS

"Fluence is basically how concentrated the energy is on the skin surface, in a spot."

"To me, fluence is king. That's the main driver of pretty much all these reactions."

"So fluence is basically your make or break for any of these treatments that we are doing?"

"Pulse width is just a technical thing designed into the laser, but it doesn't actually translate into the cooking or the denaturation process within the tissues."

"There's no point the bus of photons reaching the target if they're all tired and they can't do anything."

ABOUT THE HOSTS

Mike began his career in medical lasers in 1986 with a physics degree and a post-grad in bioengineering. He helped develop the scar-free removal of tattoos using a Q-Switched Ruby Laser in Glasgow, and the world's first IPL system. Known well in the industry for his hard truths, no BS attitude and logical answers. As the author of three books, articles for medical journals, a well read blog, a Laser Protection Advisor and contributor to the BMLA, Mike is the Laser Guru.

Lisa's claim to laser fame is being Mike's daughter. Growing up with lasers and never avoiding a physics lesson from her Dad, it was natural to enter the industry. Leaving a corporate career with a baby to jump into self employed life came with challenges. Despite that Lisa has been well recognised for her teaching style, practical tips, bringing the compassion to the science, and laser mentoring.

Instagram: @dermalase_lasertraining

https://mikemurphyblog.com

https://www.dermalasetraining.com