So much of our silly short lives is spent chasing after trophies or money or glory. Success!

But it's never really enough. We just want more trophies and more more money and one day we die and so does everything else, the end. As a culture, we've got success wrong.

Today's guest says we should instead see success as learning to lose ourselves in things - whether that's playing the piano, or sport, or listening to jolly interesting podcasts. Pursuing, and cherishing, a flow state - the only state in which we are truly contented. And perhaps if we all did that a bit more, we might bugger up the planet a little less.

Simon Mundie is a BBC sports reporter, host of the magnificent The Life Lessons Podcast, and author of the new book Champion Thinking: How to Find Success Without Losing Yourself. He's had just about every sports star you can think of on his show, and has learned more than just one book's worth of wisdom about what success really means, from those who've chased it, won it, and lost it.

Owl noises:
-- 12:48 - you can find Simon's episode with Caitlin Jenner here, and here's some words about it.
-- 21:14 - Goldie Sayers chucks it long.
-- 44:17 - Dacher Keltner's stuff on awe. I'll get him on here one day.

Your Brain on Climate is a podcast about human psychology vs the climate crisis: what we think, why we think it, and how it all adds up to a planet-sized emergency. Contact the show: @brainclimate on Twitter, or hello@yourbrainonclimate.com.

Support the show on Patreon: www.patreon.com/yourbrainonclimate.

The show is hosted and produced by me, Dave Powell, who you can find @powellds on Twitter. Original music by me too.

Show logo by Arthur Stovell at www.designbymondial.com.

Listen on: Apple Podcasts Spotify