Nicole and Jin are a gender nonconforming couple of trans experience. How are society's labels used against us and how do we allow them to shape us? What is it like to break them? And what do you face when you break them? Nicole and Jin are sharing and supporting each other as they face those challenges. This conversation is incredibly illuminating for those that identify as cisgendered and heteronormative. For those that are gender nonconforming it may reinforce experiences, questions, or feelings they've had. International Transgender Day of Visibility is March 31st and we wanted to share this conversation because it's real, it's raw, and it's honest. It sheds human light on what it means to be transgender today. FROM THE EPISODE: NICOLE: My first memory that I liked a lot was when we went to McDonald's bathroom. I'm going to cry. I felt very safe with you. And I liked that we both used the women's bathroom. And I felt really protective of you when you used the bathroom after I did, because there were men giving you stares and I got really pissed that they were looking at you. And I didn't want you to see that... JIN: Yeah, that was fun. Wasn't it? NICOLE: How do you describe our relationship to others? JIN: Sometimes I like to say that you're my boyfriend...If they ask, I say, "Yeah, I have a boyfriend. He's really cool. He has a lot of tattoos." NICOLE: That feels good. JIN: Yeah, I figured you'd like it. NICOLE: Do you ever say "girlfriend"? JIN: No. NICOLE: Do you ever say "partner"? JIN: Yeah. Sometimes. NICOLE: Do you ever say, "My gender nonconforming so-and-so? My trans..."? JIN: No, I don't feel like that's super relevant or people don't really need to know...or maybe it's that I don't feel like that's my thing to disclose. NICOLE: What would you like me to describe you as, when I'm talking to people? I say "girlfriend" or "partner." JIN: That's fine. Do people see me as a girlfriend? Are you sure? NICOLE: I'm like, "Isn't she hot?" JIN: What do you get from me that you don't get from your other relationships? NICOLE: I don't get relate-ability on this level...I don't feel reflected in some of my other relationships, meaning the trans part, yeah, we're reflecting each other's lives sometimes. In a way I don't see with like my cis male partners. I feel the femininity portion a lot with you and I also feel...what's the opposite of reflection? I feel like a boy. Not because I think you're a boy, but because I feel like your boy, JIN: I like that. NICOLE: That feels good. It feels really good. I hate talking about things in this way, but I want to protect you like a boyfriend. JIN: That's awesome. I think that's cool. I'm a sucker for weirdly internalized patriarchy things, but only in the sense that they make me feel more like a girl. For example, this isn't with you, but with my coworker who is a cis man, he's a little older than me, he's Latin American. So he comes from this machismo sort of experience and certain things that I guess would piss off a typical feminist, he'll just be like, "Hey, mami." Or "Hey, muñeca" and say stuff that's objectifying...it's common sense to be like, "get the f*ck out of here, but at the same time, I kinda I like that. It's weird cognitive dissonance there. Needs some clarifying... — Play {THE AND} Relationship Card Games: TheSkinDeep.com/Store
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