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In this fascinating episode of Wayfinders, we delve into the remarkable 30-year journey of Jason Spencer in Greater China. From his early exposure to Asian culture during his father's Air Force posting in Singapore and Malaysia in the late 1970s, to becoming deeply embedded in Shanghai's business and cultural landscape, Jason's story exemplifies how early cultural experiences can shape a lifetime of international adventure.

Jason's journey began with studying Chinese at the University of Queensland, leading to a transformative exchange year at Shanghai's Fudan University in 1993. It was here that he met his future wife, Stacey, setting the stage for a deep personal connection to China that would span decades. His academic pursuit of Chinese language and culture included translating previously untranslated Chinese literature, showing his early commitment to bridging cultural understanding.

What makes Jason's story particularly compelling is his perspective on being in China during what he calls its "golden age" from the late 1990s to early 2010s. As he shares in the episode: "Golden ages, you don't often recognize them when you're in it. Unfortunately, you need the distance of time to be able to take a look back over your shoulder and see it."

Key highlights from Jason's journey include:

• The impact of childhood exposure to Asian culture through his family's time in Singapore
• His academic journey from Chinese language studies to becoming a cultural bridge
• Living through and witnessing China's dramatic economic and social transformation
• The challenges and rewards of maintaining a family life split between Shanghai and Brisbane
• The evolution from being a cultural outsider to finding a unique identity in the "liminal space" between cultures
• Jason offers valuable insights into maintaining curiosity and engagement with a culture over decades, including his current approach to staying connected with his family while working in Shanghai. His story is particularly relevant for those considering long-term international careers or facing the challenges of maintaining family relationships across borders.

This episode of Wayfinders reminds us that sometimes the most enriching journeys aren't just about where we go, but about maintaining our curiosity and interest in the cultures we encounter along the way. As Jason puts it, it's not about being interesting, but about staying interested.

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In this captivating episode of Wayfinders, we embark on a linguistic and cultural odyssey with Genevieve Hilton, whose life story spans continents. From her early days in Pennsylvania to her current home in Hong Kong, Genevieve's journey is a testament to the transformative power of embracing new cultures and languages.

Genevieve's adventure begins with her family's influence, where dinner table conversations about international experiences sparked her curiosity about the world. This curiosity led her to major in linguistics with a minor in Slavic languages in college, setting the stage for her global adventures. Reflecting on her family's impact, Genevieve shares a poignant memory:

"My father and I watched a made-for-TV movie about a guy who was illiterate as an adult... He had a sudden realization of what it would be like to be an adult not able to read, the first time we went to Japan and looked at all the signs and couldn't make out a single word."

Her first taste of international living came through her work with Let's Go travel guides, taking her to Poland, Slovakia, Albania, and Ukraine. Genevieve's adventurous spirit is perfectly encapsulated in her own words:

"The day after I graduated from college, I got on a plane to Albania."

This bold move set the tone for a life filled with cross-cultural experiences and linguistic challenges.

A planned nine-month stay in Vietnam turned into a five-and-a-half-year adventure, where Genevieve launched her career in public relations. Her experiences in Vietnam, from learning the language to building a PR business from scratch, showcase her adaptability and entrepreneurial spirit.

What was intended to be a two-year stay in Hong Kong has now stretched to nearly 24 years, demonstrating how expat life can take unexpected turns. Genevieve offers valuable insights into the evolution of Hong Kong as an international business hub and the factors that have kept her family rooted there for so long.

Genevieve also shares her experiences of raising children in Hong Kong, balancing local education with maintaining their American heritage. Her family's story offers a unique perspective on the challenges and rewards of raising multilingual children in a multicultural environment.

Key takeaways from Genevieve's journey include:

• The power of childhood exposure: How dinner table conversations about international experiences shaped Genevieve's future path
• From Let's Go to PR pro: Leveraging travel writing experiences to build a career in international public relations
• The "two-year plan" that became 24: How Hong Kong's professional opportunities and family considerations led to long-term expatriation
• Navigating cultural integration: Balancing an American household with local Cantonese education for raising multilingual children
• The evolving expat experience: Witnessing Hong Kong's transformation from a colonial outpost to a key Chinese city

Genevieve's story is a rich tapestry of cultural experiences, professional growth, and personal discoveries. Her journey from a curious college graduate to a seasoned PR professional and long-term expat in Hong Kong offers valuable insights for anyone considering a life abroad.

This episode of Wayfinders reminds us that sometimes the most rewarding paths in life are those that lead us far from our original plans, opening doors to unexpected opportunities and lifelong adventures.

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Thank you for listening to this episode of Wayfinders! If you find Genevieve's story inspiring, please share it with others who might be contemplating their own big moves.

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In this captivating episode of Wayfinders, we dive into Matt Jorgensen's transformative journey from the coastal town of Nowra, New South Wales, to the bustling financial hub of Frankfurt, Germany.

Matt's story is a testament to the power of embracing change and the personal growth that comes from immersing oneself in a new culture.

Matt's adventure begins in Sydney, where he built a successful career in market research. Despite his professional achievements, Matt felt a pull towards something more. This desire for personal growth and new experiences led him to make the bold decision to move to Germany, a choice that would profoundly impact his life.

Upon arriving in Frankfurt, Matt faced numerous challenges that tested his resilience. From navigating the unexpected prevalence of cash transactions to adapting to the strict separation between personal and professional life in German work culture, Matt's experiences highlight the significant cultural differences between Australia and Germany. These differences extended to privacy concerns, language barriers, and even simple daily tasks like buying a computer or ordering pastries.

One of the most compelling aspects of Matt's story is his language learning journey. He arrived in Germany with basic "restaurant German" and left three years later confidently presenting to clients in their native tongue. This progression wasn't without its humorous moments!

Throughout the episode, Matt reflects on how his time in Germany shaped him as a person. He gained a new perspective on his home country, developed a deeper appreciation for Sydney, and cultivated a global network of friends. His experience underscores the value of international exposure in broadening one's worldview and fostering personal growth.

Matt's journey resonates with anyone who has ever considered taking a leap into the unknown. His story serves as an inspiration and a gentle nudge to those contemplating a similar move. As Matt puts it:

Key takeaways from Matt's experience include:

• The importance of stepping out of your comfort zone
• The value of immersing yourself in a new language and culture
• How living abroad can change your perspective on your home country
• The personal growth that comes from overcoming challenges in a foreign environment
• The lasting impact of international friendships and networks

Matt's journey from Nowra to Frankfurt and back to Sydney is more than just a story of geographical movement. It's a narrative of personal and professional growth, cultural exploration, and the transformative power of embracing new experiences. This episode of Wayfinders reminds us that sometimes, the most rewarding paths in life are the ones that lead us far from home, only to bring us back with new eyes and a broader perspective.

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Thank you for listening to this episode of Wayfinders! If you find Matt's story inspiring, please share it with others who might be contemplating their own big moves.

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In this episode, meet Matt Barton!

Matt shares his journey of moving from Melbourne, Australia to Amsterdam, the Netherlands. Matt and I dive deep into what it means to live a "big life."

Matt's story begins with an unexpected source of inspiration: the Beatles documentary. Watching it (three times, all 18 hours!) sparked a realization that he wanted more out of life, prompting him to reassess his path and pursue new adventures.

We explore the intricacies of planning and justifying such a move, both to oneself and to others. Matt shares insights into the emotional and practical aspects of uprooting one's life for a new experience.

Matt's definition of wayfinding resonates throughout our conversation: "People who are kind of like going after it, exploring the world."

A key theme that emerges is the importance of disruption and discontinuity in personal and professional growth. We discuss how stepping out of one's comfort zone can lead to unexpected opportunities and self-discovery. Matt's move from Melbourne to Amsterdam serves as a prime example of embracing change and seeking new horizons.

Throughout the episode, we touch on:

• The process of decision-making for major life changes
• Balancing the desire for new experiences with practical considerations
• The role of inspiration in motivating life-altering decisions
• Strategies for justifying unconventional choices to oneself and others
• The value of disruption in personal development

Thank you for listening to this episode of Wayfinders! If you find Matt's story inspiring, please share it with others who might be contemplating their own big moves. And remember, as Matt's journey shows us, sometimes the most rewarding paths are the ones that lead us out of our comfort zones.

And...if you know someone with a fascinating wayfinding story (or if you have one yourself!), please let me know – I'm always eager to hear more tales of adventure and personal growth.

Until next time,
Sacha.

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In this episode, meet Edward Gawne!

Ed shares his journey of moving from London, the United Kingdom, to Shanghai, China and then to the countryside to open a heritage hotel. He discusses his motivations: on the one hand, the role of ‘anti role models’ (and a person called ‘John’, who we’ll meet). On the other hand, his quest for an “interesting life.”

Ed first came to China as part of a corporate exchange program called Passport Abroad. For five months, he lived and worked in Shanghai. As he put it, he came to “like his life in China more than his life in London.” He then came back to live and work permanently in Shanghai.

But then, again as Ed puts it, “No one dreams of a career in market research”, and he took his life in a completely different direction, transitioning from a market research office in Shanghai to buying his first hotel in Jiangxi, China. This was a significant leap, to say the least! His wife, Selina, played a pivotal role in this journey. Ed first took a year out to learn Chinese full time and ‘scout the area.’ How did they find their hotel? What is ownership like in the countryside? We’ll cover all of this, and more, in this episode.

Ed and I also dissect the Chinese countryside a bit in this episode: what is the fascination Chinese have with the countryside? Why do they visit? Are their expectations met, or not? We also chat about the Chinese consumer psyche.

Ed and Selina have two hotels, as below. Please pay them a visit!

Wuyuan Skywells: https://wuyuanskywells.com/

Victoria House: https://wuyuanskywells.com/victoria-house/

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Thank you for listening to this episode of Wayfinders! If you find this interesting, please share. If you know someone suitable to be a guest (yourself included!), please let me know – very grateful.

See you next time,
Sacha.

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In this episode, met Monica Le!

Monica shares her journey of moving from China (first Ningbo, then Shanghai) to Hong Kong and then to Melbourne, Australia. She discusses the motivations behind each move, including job opportunities and a desire to explore the world.

How much planning did Monica do? As it turns out, not too much... Key here, however, is what it means to be "an interesting person" as well as how to "be in the world." It sounds deep, but Monica explains these things effortlessly for us.

I loved her reflection on the differences between the Chinese and Western education systems, highlighting the importance of hard work and never giving up in the Chinese system, while valuing critical thinking and teamwork in the Western system. And her emphasis on the need for bravery and the willingness to try new things at any age is part of what makes her moves so successful.

Having lived in China throughout the booming 2000s, I was keen to understand why leave she left Shanghai when the city was, quite frankly, 'the place to be'? Her reasons might surprise you...

And lastly, after some decent (mostly positive) research by yours truly about Melbourne - where I am from after all - I was keen to understand what the challenges are. Is Australia such a great place to live? We got into a great discussion of how to go about making international work experience relevant in a very 'domestic' market like Australia.

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Thank you for listening to this episode of Wayfinders! If you find this interesting, please share. If you know someone suitable to be a guest (yourself included!), please let me know – very grateful.

See you next time,
Sacha.

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The book I mentioned about education in China is called “Governing Educational Desire: culture, politics, and schooling in China” by Andrew B. Kipnis, published in 2011 by University of Chicago Press.

See here: https://press.uchicago.edu/ucp/books/book/chicago/G/bo10549225.html

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Welcome to the Wayfinders podcast.

This podcast is about ordinary people, people like you and me, who get up and go to live in another country. It explores their inspirations, motivations, and behaviours. It asks why. Why did they decide to move? Why did they pick their destination? And it asks how. How did they prepare? How did they live when they arrived? And it finally asks what? What have been their defining moments? What have they learned? What are they most proud of? What would they do differently next time?

Who am I and why am I doing this podcast? My name is Sacha Cody. I'm from Melbourne, Australia. I've lived in Jamaica, China, the UK, the USA, and Germany. I've been outside of Australia for probably half my life. I'm also an anthropologist by training. And so I have a fascination for Individual stories, for what they say by themselves as well as what they illuminate about bigger themes in society today.

It's my vision that this podcast can both be a platform for my guests to share their amazing stories. And also for listeners to not only enjoy them, but to be inspired by them and perhaps to go and live somewhere new themselves.

Indeed, the title Wayfinders is apt, because a Wayfinder - to me - is someone who navigates the world with curiosity, observation and intuition to find where they belong, wherever that may be.

So come, please join me and let’s stir the spirit of the new country immersions of a unique group of people I call Wayfinders.

Let’s go.

Thanks for listening! All feedback most welcome.