On this episode of Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing, Jonathan Greene shares a solo episode challenging one of the most common habits in modern real estate investing: relying too heavily on spreadsheets to make decisions. Despite openly admitting that he loves spreadsheets and uses them extensively across his businesses and daily life, Jonathan explains why investors can get themselves into trouble when spreadsheets stop being tools and start becoming substitutes for judgment, experience, and real-world investing skills.

Jonathan breaks down how spreadsheets can create a false sense of certainty by allowing investors to manipulate assumptions until a deal appears to work. From adjusting vacancy rates and repair budgets to stretching future projections and return expectations, he explains how easy it becomes to convince yourself that a deal is better — or worse — than reality. Rather than treating spreadsheets as predictive machines, Jonathan encourages investors to view them as rough frameworks that must be validated through due diligence, property visits, market knowledge, and practical experience.

The episode also explores the limitations of spreadsheets when evaluating the parts of investing that can't easily be measured. Jonathan discusses why factors like geography, neighborhood quality, tenant selection, management ability, deferred maintenance, traffic patterns, layout issues, and even intuition often matter more than perfectly modeled returns. He explains why many investors become trapped in what they call "analysis paralysis," when in reality they may simply lack enough real-world reps and confidence to make decisions.

Throughout the episode, Jonathan emphasizes that successful investing requires balancing data with action. He shares why experience sharpens judgment over time and why some of the most important investing decisions happen outside of formulas and projections. Ultimately, this episode serves as a reminder that spreadsheets should support decision-making — not replace observation, instinct, and the ability to adapt when reality inevitably differs from the model.

In this episode, you will hear:

• Why spreadsheets should be used as tools rather than substitutes for investing judgment
• How changing assumptions can make almost any deal appear to work on paper
• Why viewing properties and validating assumptions matters more than projections
• The investing risks spreadsheets cannot account for, including people, geography, and operations
• How overreliance on spreadsheets contributes to analysis paralysis and slows decision-making

Follow and Review

If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover the show and supports its continued growth.

Supporting Resources

Connect with Jonathan:

Podcast - www.zenandtheartofrealestateinvesting.com

YouTube - www.youtube.com/JonathanGreenere

Instagram - www.instagram.com/zenrealestateinvesting

Instagram- www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/TrustGreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/zenandtheartofrealestateinvesting

Jonathan's Hub Site - www.trustgreene.com

Brokerage - https://www.streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.

On this episode of Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing, Jonathan Greene welcomes back Alyssa Holbrook for her fourth appearance on the show to explore what it means to evolve your identity as an investor, lean into bigger opportunities, and build a business around what actually energizes you. Alyssa shares why she no longer primarily identifies as a coach and instead leads with being a developer — not because she stopped helping people, but because building projects and creating at scale became the clearest expression of who she is.

The conversation centers around Alyssa's newest and biggest development project yet — a luxury residential development with an estimated total value between $10 and $14 million. She opens up about navigating risk, moving through fear, evaluating partnership structures, and trusting her intuition after years of saying no to deals that weren't aligned. Rather than chasing certainty, she explains how gathering enough information and then making decisive moves has become her framework for growth.

Jonathan and Alyssa also unpack themes of agency, mentorship, and why bigger opportunities often require becoming a different version of yourself. They discuss why many investors get stuck in passive learning, how powerful decisions create momentum, and why building wealth should never come at the expense of fulfillment. Alyssa reflects on balancing ambition with ease, prioritizing relationships over money, and creating a life where growth happens intentionally instead of through crisis.

Ultimately, this episode is about redefining success — not as accumulating more properties or income, but as staying in motion, trusting your own judgment, and building a life that reflects your values. Whether you're making your first investment or stepping into a larger arena, Alyssa's perspective offers a reminder that growth often starts with saying yes before you feel fully ready.

In this episode, you will hear:

• Why Alyssa shifted her identity from coach to developer
• How to evaluate bigger opportunities without waiting for certainty
• The role intuition plays alongside logic and due diligence
• Why partnerships don't always reduce risk the way investors expect
• How powerful decisions create momentum and long-term growth
• Why staying in action matters more than waiting for perfect deals
• How coaching, mentorship, and self-awareness accelerate success
• Why fulfillment and alignment should drive business decisions

Follow and Review

If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover the show and supports its continued growth.

Supporting Resources

Connect with Alyssa:

Website - https://alyssaholbrook.as.me/consultcall

Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/alyssaholbrookcoach

LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/alyssa-holbrook-a190072a/

Connect with Jonathan:

Podcast - www.zenandtheartofrealestateinvesting.com

YouTube - www.youtube.com/JonathanGreenere

Instagram - www.instagram.com/zenrealestateinvesting

Instagram- www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/TrustGreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/zenandtheartofrealestateinvesting

Jonathan's Hub Site - www.trustgreene.com

Brokerage - https://www.streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.

On this episode of Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing, Jonathan Greene interviews John McNellis, a longtime developer, investor, writer, lecturer, and principal at McNellis Partners, as well as the author of Making It in Real Estate: Thriving as a Developer. Drawing from decades of experience in development and commercial real estate, John shares how he unexpectedly transitioned from practicing law into real estate and built a career developing shopping centers and navigating changing market cycles.

John explains how his legal background gave him an early advantage by exposing him to larger deals, partnerships, financing structures, and the people behind major real estate projects. He reflects on starting with small residential investments before moving into industrial and eventually finding his niche in retail development. Throughout the conversation, he emphasizes that investors often overcomplicate deal analysis and argues that great opportunities should still make sense with simple back-of-the-napkin math rather than relying entirely on projections and complex models.

The conversation also explores what makes retail real estate work and why location still matters more than ever. John shares insights into shopping center development, tenant relationships, traffic patterns, anchor tenants, and why concepts like "right in, right out" continue to influence successful projects. He explains how retailers think about demographics, parking, visibility, and customer behavior — and why understanding these details separates experienced operators from investors chasing surface-level opportunities.

Jonathan and John also discuss why retail has proven more resilient than many predicted despite years of headlines claiming e-commerce would replace physical stores. John shares how successful retail operators adapted by combining physical locations with online fulfillment and explains why neighborhood shopping centers continue to perform well. Ultimately, the episode highlights that great real estate investing still comes down to relationships, understanding human behavior, and staying focused on fundamentals over trends.

In this episode, you will hear:

• How John McNellis transitioned from law into real estate development
• Why simple underwriting often beats complicated financial models
• What makes shopping centers succeed or fail over time
• How traffic patterns, anchor tenants, and demographics drive retail performance
• Why retail real estate continues to evolve rather than disappear
• How experienced developers evaluate opportunities and avoid common mistakes
• Why local knowledge and relationships create long-term investing advantages

Follow and Review

If you enjoy the show, please follow Zen and the Art of Real Estate Investing on Apple Podcasts and leave a rating and review. It helps other listeners discover the show and supports its continued growth.

Supporting Resources

Connect with John McNellis

Website - https://www.johnmcnellis.com/

Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/@JohnMcNellis-CRE

LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-mcnellis-b6a1674/

Connect with Jonathan Greene:

Podcast - www.zenandtheartofrealestateinvesting.com

YouTube - www.youtube.com/JonathanGreenere

Instagram - www.instagram.com/zenrealestateinvesting

Instagram- www.instagram.com/trustgreene

Bigger Pockets - www.biggerpockets.com/users/TrustGreene

Facebook - www.facebook.com/zenandtheartofrealestateinvesting

Jonathan's Hub Site - www.trustgreene.com

Brokerage - https://www.streamlined.properties

This episode was produced by Outlier Audio.